Post by Don Ricardo on Nov 15, 2009 14:52:39 GMT 10
1966 Aristavan purchased by Willyn from Albany, WA in August 2009:
Pics of the Aristavan's large hatch posted by Willyn on 11 September 2009:
The external paintwork on the van is not original, but note the similar if not identical profiles of the Aristavan and the Aristrocrat van which commenced this thread, especially the unusual and relatively small front windows placed under the quite prominent front bulkhead.
The Aristavan logo is virtually identical to the Aristocrat logo, indicating that the vans were produced by the same company:
This leaves a few questions:
1. When did Aristocrat change it's name to Aristavan or vice versa? (The Aristavan was claimed by the previous owner to be 1966, whereas Trev's Aristocrat is 1968, so perhaps it was vice versa?)
2. What does the 'C & W' on both logos stand for?
3. Is the proper designation for the vans actually C... & W... Aristocrat and C... & W... Aristavan?
4. Did Aristocrat/Aristavan only build small vans?
5. The Aristocrat logo says it is Mk II - what did Mk I look like?
6. The address given on the Aristocrat logo is 'Caravanland, Scarborough Beach Road, Osborne Park'. Does this info provide any clues as to the origins of Aristocrat/Aristavan caravans?
Post by Don Ricardo on Apr 7, 2015 22:51:29 GMT 10
Advertisement and information for Aristocrat and Aristavan caravans published in the 1967 Winser caravan manual:
(Source: K Winser, Caravan Manual & Tourist Park Guide, 19th edition, 1967, p 159)
The advertisement and other info presented in the manual provide an answer to some of the questions that have been raised over the years about the relationship between Aristavan and Aristocrat caravans. The two brandnames were applied to two separate ranges of caravans built by the same firm which were available at the same time, and which differed in size (although overlapping), construction and weight - and level of fit-out? - and price.
The Aristavans ranged in size from 9 ft to 16 ft (20 ft according to the advert), were clad in Crezon (see below) and aluminium, and in 1967 ranged in price from $790 to $1,710. In contrast, Aristocrats ranged in size from 12 ft 6 in to 28 ft (30 ft according to the advert), were clad entirely in aluminium, and ranged in price from $1,590 to $5,200. As a comparison, the 16 ft Aristavan Regal weighed 17 cwt, and cost $1,710, while the 16 ft Aristocrat Deluxe weighed 18 cwt and cost $2,170. (Info from pages 150 and 151 of the 1967 caravan manual.)
The advertisement indicates that Aristavans and Aristocrats were built by Caravan Industries Pty Ltd in Osborne Park, although the text underneath the photo in the top right hand corner of the page refers to 'C & W Industries'. It seems that the vans were then sold through Caravanland in Osborne Park and several other locations.
It is interesting to note that the 'C & W' logo appears in the advert and is shown on the signage on the vans (see examples higher up this thread). It is not clear from this whether 'C & W' relates to the manufacturer (Caravan Industries) or to the retailer (Caravanland), or perhaps they were all part of the same enterprise? In any case, we still don't know what 'C & W' stands for, although it has been suggested semi-seriously that it is short for Country & Western!
And if you're wondering, 'Crezon' was an external-grade ply with a pre-coated surface, so probably similar to Rescote used by other van manufacturers. These days it is apparently mainly used for outdoor signage.
Post by Don Ricardo on Apr 8, 2015 15:28:06 GMT 10
Photos of Aza's 9 ft Aristavan Sprite posted on 9 September 2014:
When posting the photos, Aza commented:
I originally assumed that maybe Aristavan was the name given to the 9FT model but it seems that's not the case as we have a picture of a 9FT with the name Aristacrat. Also I have seen many Aristacrat vans, always MK2 and never a MK1, including a MK2 with a very similar shape to the Carapark toaster style models. All of them have been completely aluminium unlike the Aristavan with ply (?) sides. So the question still remains, is there a MK1 ?... As for the C & W, I was told from someone that also has a mini Aristavan that they have always believed it stood for Country & Western...
Mine appears very similar to both Trev's and Willyn's although like Trev's both the front and rear windows are fixed on mine where as it appears Willyn's can be opened ? On 11 September 2014, Firefighter posted an advertisement for Caravanland from the Winser's 1967 Plans for Caravans as part of the discussion about Aza's Aristavan:
(Source: K Winser, Plans for Caravans, 12 edition, 1967)
Note that the advert refers to 'Caravanland' in Scarborough Beach Road, and then lists the factory as being 'Caravan Industries' in Collingwood Street. My reading of this is that they were all part of the one enterprise. Also note - no mention of 'C & W'! Later the same day Aza replied:
Yes, thanks for posting the add for us firefighter. I had wondered if the stripe on the side of my van was original and it seems it may well be... During the discussion that followed Firefighter's post, it was noted that the Apache model referred to in the advertisement was not an Aristavan or Aristocrat model, but an imported camper trailer sold by Caravanland - see here
I think I can help with this thread as my father was the factory manager for C&W Industries in their heyday. He now has dementia so it may take awhile, I'll glean as much info as I can, now that I know it is of historical interest.
What I do know is that we owned the very first little Aristavan, as my father dreamt up, designed, prototyped, personally built and road registered the very first one. I'm fairly sure my mother can find photos. We had it for years and I'm feeling very proud of my father over people's interest in these cute little vans and that there is forming an historical reference to them.
I'm fairly certain that the W in C&W Industries is for Woodhead, the surname of two brothers who were part of the ownership. One was John Woodhead, I can't remember the other brothers name and I presume the C in C&W was the surname of the other partner but I forget and only remember John, as he was a close friend of our family. More too come...
Last Edit: Apr 23, 2020 14:28:47 GMT 10 by wambo: Grammar corrections
I thought important to add the name of the person who dreamt up and created this particular caravan concept, Robert Alexander Graves McKenzie of 7 Croker Road, North Innaloo, Perth Western Australia, factory manager of Caravanland, C&W Industries. This is our old address at the time in the 1960s.
Last Edit: Apr 23, 2020 14:26:49 GMT 10 by wambo: Added more info
I renovated a 1962 C&W van recently. I’’d upload a pic if I could figure out how.
At the time I enquired about the manufacturers with a guy at Northside in Wangarra WA and he was terrific. He knew the history - the C & W stood for the two owners surnames. (Can’t recall, could be Cooper and Woods - but don’t trust my memory) He said the company with this structure was only around for a few years and then went broke.
Post by Don Ricardo on Aug 2, 2020 13:05:02 GMT 10
Hi Lil 062,
How great is that - to have connected with someone who could tell you a bit about the history of C&W. In a post higher up this thread Bella2012 wrote that C&W stood for Cummings & Woodhead. Does that fit with what you were told?
It will be great to see the photos of your van. There are instructions on how to post photos in the ‘Forum Guidelines & Helpful Hints’ section of the forum - just go to the Home page. The most effective way to post photos is via a photo storage website such as Flickr or Postimage.
An alternative way of posting photos is by using the ‘Add Attachment’ button. There are instructions there for that too. However, I see you are posting on the forum using your mobile phone, so if you are wanting to use ‘Add Attachment’ please note that you need to scroll down to the bottom of the ‘Create Post’ window and click on ‘Desktop’ which will then allow you to use ‘Add Attachment’. (That works with an iPhone and I presume on an Android phone too?)
If you’re having trouble posting photos, let us know and I will try and help you. (Or you can email your photos to me and I’ll post them for you.)
Sorry if it sounds fiddly, but don’t give up. We really would like to see the photos of your van.