dano
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by dano on Jun 19, 2019 19:22:55 GMT 10
Hi everyone, my names Dan, I’m 21 and from Newcastle, NSW. I love all things old and currently own a beautiful little vintage caravan; however, I am unable to identity where or when it is from. It is approximately 11 foot long. I purchased the van from South Australia, the previous owner knew nothing about the caravan, it was left in the shed when he bought a house and he left it untouched for over 30 years until selling it to me. It was transported to me via car trailer and I have since had a new trailer made and fitted. I am planning to restore the caravan to its former glory but have opened a small café and time is proving difficult to find. I would love to identify and find out all I can about the caravan. Also, If anyone has any idea as to what it may be worth now and once restored that would be great. I am happy to consider any expressions of interest. The caravan is in amazing condition for its age with no signs of rot. The chassis is made from hardwood and is in original condition. I believe the body is made from masonite panels, removal of exterior panels and replacement of new ones straight back onto the chassis might be the way to go. The internal panels are largely intact and could be left as is, or the same replacement process could be achieved. The external roof is covered in canvas. I am yet to research how to restore? The bench, sink, cupboard’s, draws and internal roof are in excellent condition and could be left untouched, alternatively, sand and paint. The windows around the caravan are all perfectly intact! The sandblasting work is incredible and may be able to help determine the age of the caravan? I honestly believe it could find its place in a museum, it truly is one of a kind. If anyone has any ideas on what materials I should use to replace the body panels and how to restore the roof that would be greatly appreciated. Any other thoughts, advice, forums or helpful links regarding the restoration process would be amazing, this is my first resto. I believe it should be kept as original as possible! Below are photos of the caravan and features that may be used to identify its history. To see more photos, follow this link: www.flickr.com/photos/182086656@N04/Thank you, Dan Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Sandblast Window by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Cupboard??? by Daniel, on Flickr Flooring by Daniel, on Flickr Power by Daniel, on Flickr Door stop by Daniel, on Flickr Markings by Daniel, on Flickr Markings by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr Untitled by Daniel, on Flickr
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Post by Franklin1 on Jun 19, 2019 20:39:41 GMT 10
G'day dano, and welcome to the forum!
One of your photos shows a scrap of newspaper stuck to the linoleum flooring. On the left side of that scrap of newspaper is a story about a racehorse named "Iron Duke" who had recently missed the start in the "Fisher Plate" horse race at Flemington racecourse. That race was held on Saturday 10 November 1951, so the article would have been printed perhaps a week or two after that. This would mean that the original linoleum flooring was laid a number of years prior to 1951.
There is a saying on this forum that goes: "It's your van and you can do what you like with it." However, we don't often see vans from the era that your van appears to be from, and many of us would strongly encourage that such a van is preserved as it was built. I would hope that you keep the original chassis, so that sometime in the future it could be mated back with the van, to restore the van back to its original appearance.
So endeth my sermon.
cheers, Al.
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Post by hughdeany on Jun 19, 2019 21:07:52 GMT 10
Hi Dani, It looks very much like a small version of a Paramount caravan built in SA last century. See what others think, Cheers hughdeany
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Post by Don Ricardo on Jun 19, 2019 23:34:55 GMT 10
Hi Dano, Great to see that that van has gone to someone who is interested in vintage items, and who is keen to restore it to its former glory. That’s fantastic. I have been thinking along the same lines as Hughdeany - your van seems to have a lot of similarities to the Paramount caravans built in South Australia - you can see some examples here. You’ll see that the Paramounts have a similar ‘tudor’ ceiling inside with the visible ribs, a similar shallow external wheel arch, and the Paramounts also have highly decorative windows, some of which are etched like yours. A couple of other similarities are the canvas covered roof, and the little extra luxury items inside the van, like the hooks for hanging things you’ve shown us, the cup holders in the cupboards, and the dividers in the cupboard. One other thing to note is that the coloured flash you’ve uncovered on one side of the van is similar to the flash used on Paramounts (but it was also a common decoration on vans built by other manufacturers as well). One difference between your van and the Paramounts is that your van has a pretty straight up and down front, compared to the curved front on the Paramounts. However, it is possible that your van is just a bit earlier than the Paramounts we have photos of. There are a couple of things we can definitely say about your van: 1. The canvas roof, Tudor ceiling and Treg coupling (the rubber block) - and location of where the van was hidden away - almost certainly mean it was built in South Australia. 2. The design and features of the van indicate that it was built in the 1930’s. As such, it is one of only a handful of vintage vans around that are that old, and that historic. Given that the van is from the 1930’s it is worth keeping it as original as possible. With that in in mind I agree with Franklin1 that you should make sure that you keep the original chassis, Treg coupling, axle and wheels safe so that at some stage they can be reinstalled. Your van is worth more (both in its current condition, or restored) if it has the original chassis than without. When you’re restoring your van, you don’t have to worry about meeting current caravan regulations re coupling, lights, safety features, etc. If your van was built before 1989, you only have to meet whatever regulations applied when your van was built, providing it is in reasonably original condition and hasn’t been significantly modified. So for that reason, your original chassis is perfectly legal, providing it’s sound. Now one other comment, and that’s about the ply trademarks. Austral Plywood began manufacturing ply in 1925, so that certainly fits with a 30’s build date for your van. Likewise Bull Dog ply has been around for a very long time. So that’s consistent too. There’s info on plywood trademarks here which you might find interesting. Austral and Bull Dog were both manufacturers operating in suburban Brisbane. For some reason a lot of the ply found in vintage vans from the 30’s and 40’s was manufactured in Queensland. I’m not sure why that was - maybe that was related the source of the right kind of timber? Anyway, even though most ply was made in Queensland, it was used by caravan manufacturers all around Australia. It would be nice to think that '5.32' stamped on the Austral ply meant that it was manufactured in May 1932. It may possibly mean that - manufacturers of ply, galvanised iron, etc, sometimes used to date their product in this way - but it may not. However, if we can establish that Austral did date their ply that would help you date your van more precisely. We look forward to hearing more about your van as you work on it. There’s lots of info on the forum about all sorts of restoration topics, so keep asking questions as you go, and we’ll try and point you to info that will help you. Don Ricardo
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Post by Roehm3108 on Jun 20, 2019 7:25:45 GMT 10
Hi Dano What a great barn find! A piece of history that needs to be saved and preserved if at all possible. I agree with previous posters, that if that chassis is able to be salvaged and restored, then it would add to the historical significance of this van. Perhaps a simple reinforcing of the frame is possible, without detracting from its appearance? That's for you to decide. One of the guidelines of this forum is that we don't talk values/prices. It is too subjective a topic and there really isn't a guide to prices like with modern cars. It's worth whatever someone is prepared to pay for it and you're prepared to accept. Your van reminds me very much of the Windmill caravans of the 30's era, but certainly with a better fitout.
Good luck with it all
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dano
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by dano on Jun 20, 2019 20:31:45 GMT 10
Thank you everyone for getting back to me. I still have the original chassis in it's original condition. Once back in Newcastle, I needed a way to tow the caravan for restoration purposes (I am still having trouble finding a place to store the caravan whilst restoring). The trailer company provided me with two similar quotes: 1. To alter the original chassis. I was unaware that the chassis did not have to meet "current caravan regulations" as Don has pointed out. In this case, this quote was based on heavy modifications including the removal of the original draw bar and replacement for a longer one, a new coupling, lights, safety features etc. 2. A brand new chassis, the caravan would simply be unbolted from the original and bolted onto the new custom built trailer (based on the original chassis). I naively opted for option two. Had I known about current regulations, I would have asked for a quote to make the original chassis appropriate. I regret not coming to the forum sooner and asking for advice. I think from here I will head back to the trailer company for a quote regarding the original chassis. Hopefully, they may be able to use the 'new' trailer for something else and I can get some $$$ back . Don, if you could post a link regarding current caravan regulations for my own reference that would be greatly appreciated. Also, a long shot, but does anyone know somewhere I may be able to store the van in a sheltered area around Newcastle whilst restoration takes place? Regarding the age of the caravan, there seems to be two opinions: 1. 1930's: based on the design and features of the van and ply trademarks. 2. 1950's: based on the newspaper article on the linoleum flooring. Maybe the linoleum flooring was added later? Is there much history on this type of flooring, time period etc? I will do some digging regarding Austral ply and the '5.32' stamp, hopefully I can find some clarification. Thanks again, Dan
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Post by Franklin1 on Jun 20, 2019 22:09:06 GMT 10
G'day dano,
You may have misinterpreted the info I gave you about the scrap of newspaper. What that date suggests is that the paper was stuck to the linoleum flooring some time after Nov 1951. That does not mean the van was built in the 1950s. I agree with the other opinions about it being from the 1930s or thereabouts.
The 5 32 stamp on the Austral plywood could mean it was 5/32 inches thick (or 4mm, near enough).
cheers, Al.
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dano
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by dano on Sept 10, 2019 18:28:07 GMT 10
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