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Post by cobber on May 19, 2015 9:15:02 GMT 10
G'day Atog, Pinning this thread in the whatever section of the forum is a good suggestion, and a good compromise. You would have noticed that the other thread for commercial caravans built and modified before 1970 is in the DHL section of the forum . The forum guidlines indicate that the primary focus of this forum is the preservation and restoration of pre 1970 caravans and that " vintagecaravans.com does not support the modification of vintage caravans for commercial purposes, or for purposes other than what were originally intended by the manufacturer " Moving this thread about commercial caravans made or modified for commercial use after 1970 into the Down History Lane section would be a contravention of the guidlines, the fact that the thread exists at all shows how some old diehards are willing to compromise  Cobber. |
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Post by atouchofglass on May 19, 2015 10:07:17 GMT 10
Thanks for clearing that up for me Cobber I didn't realise we had two threads on Commercial vans. Cheers Atog |
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Post by Geoff & Jude on May 19, 2015 10:08:55 GMT 10
hi cobber and atog it just goes to show that we often tend to half read the things that are written in front of us. it wasn't until i read cobber's response that i realised that we were talking about the post 1970's thead. derrrrrrrr.  geoff 'n jude |
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Post by Don Ricardo on May 19, 2015 12:40:20 GMT 10
Hi ATOG and others, Thanks for your post ATOG, because it enables us to address what may be an incorrect impression some people have developed regarding commercial vans being represented on the forum. You have already received a few responses to your post, but speaking as the cleaner at the 'DHL museum' (as it once was called), I want to assure you that there is definitely no negative feelings regarding information being posted about commercial vans as such in the DHL section. Caravans have been used commercially since the beginning of the caravan industry in Australia - and here I am meaning the 1860's. In fact the earliest caravans were used for commercial purposes well before people got the 'strange idea' of using them for a holiday or recreation. So commercial caravans are definitely part of "Australia's touring heritage" and this is reflected in various threads in DHL. Most of the information is posted on the threads about particular manufacturers or brandnames - so there is info about commercial vans on the Franklin, Carapark, Highway, Don and Gason threads, and they are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head. In addition there is the info on individual caravans which were used for a commercial/community purpose on some of the 'decade threads' (eg the 1920's thread), and on the 'commercial caravans' thread that Cobber pointed everyone to. So commercial vans? No issue. I think the issue that does lead to a variety of views on the forum is holiday vans which are converted for a commercial purpose. Of course such conversion of vans is not new and has happened throughout the decades - at least from the 1920's. I know that in the past - and the not so distant past  - some forum members have expressed 'anxiety' about the 're-purposing' of holiday vans. However it is something that is very popular at the moment, and we need to adapt to that on the forum. Indeed its popular to the extent that Woody Caravans in Queensland has built a business out of building new, vintage-style caravans to be used as mobile cafes etc. And good on them for that. I have stated my personal position on a number of occasions - and will do so again here - and that is that I would rather see a vintage van be converted for commercial use than going to the tip. At least that way it is preserved, and I am certain that converted vans actually act as a great advertisement for the vintage van movement that is seen by people who may never come to a classic car/caravan display, and that is a genuine plus. My only qualm is when a very rare or a historically significant vintage holiday van is converted rather than restored to original condition, but that also applies to vans that are modernised (now I'm really in trouble ). Even so, when push comes to shove I would rather see even a rare or historically significant van converted to commercial use (or modernised) than be trashed or taken to the tip. But that's just the view of someone with a keen interest in history. Regarding this thread - which was your original point  - because it deals with vans that have been converted to commercial use in the 'modern' era, I don't think it belongs in the DHL section. But I do think it's time it was taken out of the 'Whatever' section as well. Perhaps it should be stickeyed in the 'Members' Photo Album' section or stickeyed in the 'General' section? The only problem with stickeying threads is that when there are enough of them in a section that's all you see on the first page of the relevant thread index. However, as indicated I do think it's time this thread was moved. In the end that's up to the Administrator to decide as he sees fit... Don Ricardo |
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Post by cobber on May 19, 2015 13:05:38 GMT 10
Everybody  I notice 'THE THREAD' has already been stickeyed in the 'whatever' section right at the top of the board AND in bold type  More noticable than the pre 1970 commercial caravan thread that is buried somewhere in the DHL section  Cobber. |
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Post by atouchofglass on May 19, 2015 13:23:24 GMT 10
Hi Don Richardo I am with you on the use of vintage vans rather than being tip fodder. It would also be better that a rare example of any van be saved even if modified for commercial purposes. Thou I too would rather rare examples not be turned into business ventures. The Country Club vans come to mind, so few of them being left. As this site is primarily about pre 70's vintage caravans used for touring not commercial purposes I understand the hesitance in pinning the pre 70's commercial thread in DHL. But it is a subject that would be buried (as Cobber pointed out) if it isn't. If a member has a love of their choice of vans they will hunt it more readily. Commercial vans cover so many caravan brands, would be a shame to see it buried. Thanks for the clarification. Everybody I notice 'THE THREAD' has already been stickeyed in the 'whatever' section right at the top of the board AND in bold type More noticable than the pre 1970 commercial caravan thread that is buried somewhere in the DHL section Cobber. Cobber This thread was buried back on page 3 - it has only just been pinned since this discussion has taken place. Cheers Atog |
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Post by cobber on May 19, 2015 13:44:14 GMT 10
Everybody I notice 'THE THREAD' has already been stickeyed in the 'whatever' section right at the top of the board AND in bold type More noticable than the pre 1970 commercial caravan thread that is buried somewhere in the DHL section Cobber. Cobber This thread was buried back on page 3 - it has only just been pinned since this discussion has taken place. Cheers Atog G'day Atog, Yes I was aware that THE THREAD was not previously pinned, I was just pointing out that already TODAY it has been pinned, at the top of the board AND in bold type.....how good is that ? And by-the-way you said " As this site is primarily about pre 70's vintage caravans used for touring not commercial purposes I understand the hesitance in pinning the pre 70's commercial thread in DHL."I understand you meant to say Post 70's..... it's one of the problems on any forum, people often misinterpret other peoples good intentions by the ommission or use of one word, there I haven't said that very well but...I know what I mean . Cobber. Cobber. |
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Post by Don Ricardo on May 19, 2015 13:53:34 GMT 10
More noticable than the pre 1970 commercial caravan thread that is buried somewhere in the DHL section True Cobber, But the 'Commercial & Non-touring Caravans (modified pre-1970)' thread IS in the DHL Index, and if we stickeyed everybody's favourite DHL thread in the threads list where would we end up...? Same place as now, I think. Don Ricardo |
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Post by Don Ricardo on Sept 21, 2015 14:28:58 GMT 10
Hi all, Son Number 1 does a fair bit of traveling for work and fairly often comes up with a photo he knows will interest me/us. This one is a caravan in use as a barista's office in a 'funky cafe' (his description) in Lyttleton Terrace, Bendigo:  Not sure what it is/was? A Wayfarer perhaps? Don Ricardo |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 14:53:21 GMT 10
Hi Don,
That one is a Roma.
Cheers
hughdeani
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Post by shesgotthelook on Oct 9, 2015 7:53:13 GMT 10
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Post by Don Ricardo on Nov 16, 2015 9:19:33 GMT 10
Morning all, On Saturday Dona Ricardo and I attended the Taste of Melbourne food festival. As we wandered around the stalls a vintage caravan caught my eye:    As I walked around the van, I thought to myself "I know this van". And I did! The last time we saw it was at the 2014 Vintage Caravans Nationals at Broken Hill - none other than Brenten and Robyn's beautifully restored Pilgrim caravan:  I am reasonably tolerant about vintage caravans being "re-purposed" for commercial use, but this van is the only Pilgrim we know of still in existence, so I must say I felt a bit sad to see that it was no longer in its original condition. But at least it is still being looked after and cared for.  I should emphasise that my comments are not in anyway directed at Brenten and Robyn. They did a fantastic job of restoring the van - it was a joy to behold at Broken Hill. And none of us have any control over what happens to our vans after they leave our hands. Don Ricardo |
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Post by shesgotthelook on Nov 16, 2015 11:12:17 GMT 10
That is a shame I don't mind folks taking a sad & somewhat rundown van & re-purposing it but to totally change a meticulously restored vehicle defies logic. I could have sold them a Franklin van  |
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Post by cobber on Nov 16, 2015 14:23:11 GMT 10
My thoughts  ,the promotion of this trendy fad for converting vintage caravans into food and drink outlets, whether they were neglected in a paddock or, like this one, lovingly restored, does nothing to encourage the restoration of vintage caravans, WHICH IS WHAT THIS FORUM IS ABOUT ! All I can do is make sure I don't buy junk food from a butchered vintage caravan. Apart from the obvious observation that "it is their van, they can burn it if they like" I'd like to hear somebody justify the treatment of this particular van in this way. I'm not even sure of the justification for this thread on this forum My sympathies are extended to Robyn and Brenten, looks like these people might have at least hung onto the Marconi track Cobber |
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Post by atouchofglass on Nov 16, 2015 14:46:40 GMT 10
I am reasonably tolerant about vintage caravans being "re-purposed" for commercial use, but this van is the only Pilgrim we know of still in existence, so I must say I felt a bit sad to see that it was no longer in its original condition. But at least it is still being looked after and cared for. Don Ricardo What an absolute disaster!  To take a beautifully restored van and butcher it is nothing short of ....... criminal. My feelings have always been that a van that has been neglected and is heading to the tip or scrapyard should be saved at all costs. But this..... no f..... way. We can't control what uses the buyers of a van does, sadly. This just burns me up. Apart from the obvious observation that "it is their van, they can burn it if they like" I'd like to hear somebody justify the treatment of this particular van in this way. I'm not even sure of the justification for this thread on this forum My sympathies are extended to Robyn and Brenten, looks like these people might have at least hung onto the Marconi track Cobber This thread is justified Cobber. Showing what can happen is a warning to all those selling their beloved vans. Just because of one rotten apple, you don't give up on the whole barrel. Still steamed about the destruction of such an example of a well restored vintage van. Atog |
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Post by brenten on Nov 16, 2015 17:20:52 GMT 10
he told me he was joining the forum to use the van as it was i was thinking the other day why it has not been on runs now we know if i ever sell another van it will be to forum members only ....brenten
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Post by stevej on Jan 10, 2016 15:53:53 GMT 10
the promotion of this trendy fad for converting vintage caravans into food and drink outlets, whether they were neglected in a paddock or, like this one, lovingly restored, does nothing to encourage the restoration of vintage caravans, WHICH IS WHAT THIS FORUM IS ABOUT ! Cobber Coober I have pointed out numerous times that education about appropriate choice of van for such conversions will bring better outcomes than huffing and puffing about the evils of all van conversions. If you alienate a person with a blusterous arrogant attitude then you have ZERO chance of educating them and ZERO chance preventing the situation that unfortunatly occurred with the Pilgrim van. |
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Post by stevej on Jan 10, 2016 16:18:34 GMT 10
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Post by King Fisher on Jan 20, 2016 12:57:05 GMT 10
All I can say about that loverly pilgrim caravan that has been converted is "NOT HAPPY J-A-N!!" I normally have no problem with paddock bombs being converted or reproductions constructed as a look-alike, however it is a real pity to see such a perfectly restored, historic and rare van changed forever (or until one of us get hold of it anyway ). It is more the loss of the historic value of the van that upsets the most, however at the end of the day an owner can do what they want with their van. |
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Post by stevej on Jan 28, 2016 20:41:48 GMT 10
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bobt
Full Member
"Ugly as Sin"
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Post by bobt on Feb 1, 2016 21:32:21 GMT 10
Growing up in the 50's & 60's I saw lots of Caraparks around my fathers work sites, they were used as either site offices or workmen shacks. I never thought they were used for accommodation. We always had bond wood caravans sometimes we lived in them and a lot of the time we holiday'd in them.
Bobt
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Post by King Fisher on Feb 26, 2016 7:48:56 GMT 10
very nice re-purposing of a bombed out van, looks like it has come up a treat. As I often say its better to see a paddock bomb re-purposed to a commercial van then have it rot away, however its always sad to see a perfect fine vintage van converted to a commercial.
Shes beautiful. Good work.
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Post by stevej on Oct 8, 2016 7:48:04 GMT 10
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Post by Don Ricardo on Oct 8, 2016 11:58:20 GMT 10
G'day Stevej, Another beautifully rebuilt Carapark from your workshop. I'm sure everyone here appreciates the quality of your workmanship. I certainly do, and it is far better to see the van re-purposed than being sent to the tip or being used as a chook shed or storage for horse feed! You comment on the Carapark toasters being viewed as the 'the ugly duckling of the VV world', and it is true that the toaster style does not appeal to everybody, but that applies to some degree to almost every shape and style of vintage caravan I reckon. However, I think that one of the factors that has deterred vintage vanners from tackling a toaster, is that they look harder to restore than many other types, and almost always seem to be suffering from rust and water leak issues. You have developed the skills and know how to be able to refurbish and re-build the toasters, and full marks to you for that. You definitely show us what is possible.  (On a previous version of the forum, that emoticon used to convey a sense of 'very cool, man', but the current emoticon seems to look a bit sinister somehow. I am only trying to say 'very cool'!!) Just out of interest, have you had any clients who have asked you to restore a Carapark toaster to original condition as a holiday van? Don Ricardo |
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Post by stevej on Oct 12, 2016 0:25:09 GMT 10
Thanks for your kind and considered comments DR. The Toasters I think are probably easier to restore than a wood frame vans, rust issues tend to be relatively minor in the big scheme of things and a fairly easy fix. The inherit vice of these little vans is the poor quality of original sealants which only had a 10 to 15 year life span before critical failure and the leaking started closely followed by other problems. The simple lap joins are easily removed, cleaned and refixed with contemporary sealant/adhesives and modern sealed end rivets to provide a reliable and long-term solution to the leak problems. All this work is quite basic, requires minimal skill and equipment which actually suites the hobby restorer. I have just changed my business name and updated my website as the business is expanding, we have new skill sets and are taking on a broader range of projects. The new direction is not just vans but they will certainly remain a large part of what we do. We are about to launch a new video channel with weekly updates demonstrating a range of restoration procedures on a whole range of projects but obviously the toaster caravans will feature heavily in these videos. Within a few months we will have videoed the complete step by step exterior restoration techniques for a Toaster touring van – very useful and valuable information to share. I will post a link in the next few weeks when the channel is up and running. www.vintagerestorations.com.au/We tend to find that the cost of doing touring vans to a good standard is prohibitive, we have a few vans that we have done 'repair' or minor restoration works on but no full frame up touring van restos for paying customers - we are more than open to it though :-) . We avoid doing straight repair work. As with most proper full caravan restorations, the cost in materials and labour usually exceeds the $ value of the finished van. The $ return from a vintage van based business justifies customers spending 40 to 60 grand on a restoration and repurpose… a sad reality. Steve |
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- some forum members have expressed 'anxiety' about the 're-purposing' of holiday vans. However it is something that is very popular at the moment, and we need to adapt to that on the forum. Indeed its popular to the extent that Woody Caravans in Queensland has built a business out of building new, vintage-style caravans to be used as mobile cafes etc. And good on them for that.
- because it deals with vans that have been converted to commercial use in the 'modern' era, I don't think it belongs in the DHL section. But I do think it's time it was taken out of the 'Whatever' section as well. Perhaps it should be stickeyed in the 'Members' Photo Album' section or stickeyed in the 'General' section? The only problem with stickeying threads is that when there are enough of them in a section that's all you see on the first page of the relevant thread index. However, as indicated I do think it's time this thread was moved. In the end that's up to the Administrator to decide as he sees fit...
,the promotion of this trendy fad for converting vintage caravans into food and drink outlets, whether they were neglected in a paddock or, like this one, lovingly restored, does nothing to encourage the restoration of vintage caravans, WHICH IS WHAT THIS FORUM IS ABOUT !
