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Post by brenten on Nov 25, 2015 9:58:09 GMT 10
hi guys i know there is not a lot of furnessen,s ( is that what people with furness vans are called )out there. im curious to try and learn its age a spoke with anthony furness he thinks because it has masonite walls its a early one the serial number is 3075 any ideas thanks brenten
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Post by akeepsake on Nov 25, 2015 13:45:48 GMT 10
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Post by Don Ricardo on Dec 23, 2016 20:43:58 GMT 10
Hi Brenten,
As you may have noticed, I have been digging up whatever information I can about Furness serial numbers, and found your post saying that your Furness is number 3075. Is that's what's on the little tag on the apex of your drawbar?
If that number is correct, I'd say that it would make your van quite a late one, rather than an early one. But I am surprised that the number is so high. Other numbers I've found are in the hundreds - between 200 and 441. Number 441 is said to have been built in 1947, and given that Furness built vans into the late 50's, you'd expect serial numbers perhaps into the thousands, but a number as high as 3075 surprises me. That seems like a big number of vans for a South Australian manufacturer to me. Don produced vans from 1934 to 1965 in a bigger market and only ended up with a total of around 2,500 to 3,000.
The other thing that interests me is that if that's your serial number on the little tag on the apex of the drawbar, that's a different method for putting the serial number on than we've seen on other Furnesses, where the numbers have been created from weld.
I'm not saying that your van isn't number 3075, just trying to make sense of the information available to us thus far. I'll be interested to hear your comments.
Don Ricardo
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Post by shesgotthelook on Dec 24, 2016 8:44:20 GMT 10
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Post by brenten on Dec 24, 2016 10:29:52 GMT 10
that number was welded digits ..on the a frame ....brenten
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Post by Don Ricardo on Dec 24, 2016 13:33:17 GMT 10
Hi Brenten, Apologies for hassling you about the details of the serial number for your Furness. I just discovered that you told us about the actual number, how the number was done, and where, in a post back on 5 December on the DHL Furness thread - I obviously couldn't see it for looking!  So, if your serial number is 3075, that tells us that Furness produced more caravans than we (I?) imagined - presumably 3,000+ unless they changed their numbering system along the way, which on the face of it doesn't appear to be the case. I think also that the fact that your serial number is 3075 would also indicate that it was built a fair way into Furness's production. The Furness advertised on Ebuy a while ago was number 441, and was said to be produced in 1947. Taking that at face value, that's 2,634 vans before yours. Let's pick a date and say your van was produced in 1955 - that would mean that Furness produced a steady 329 vans a year from 1947 to 1955. That would be 6.3 vans a week, which seems a bit unlikely for caravans which as far as we know weren't built on an industrial assembly line. Let's say that your van was built right at the end of Furness's production, which we'll guess for the purposes of the exercise was 1959. That would mean that Furness produced a steady 219 vans a year from 1947 to 1959, or 4.2 vans a week, which is still quite a lot. All that goes to suggest to me that your van was produced later in Furness's caravan production life, rather than earlier. What do you think? Of course all this is pure speculation until we obtain some more serial numbers and find out if there are Furness vans out there with higher serial numbers than yours. Don Ricardo (PS I presume the number on the little tag welded to the apex of the drawbar that I can see in one of my photos on the DHL thread is a VIN number which has been added for the purposes of registration?) |
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Post by brenten on Dec 24, 2016 14:41:17 GMT 10
yes the tag was added just before south west rocks to get rego the 3075 number was not on vic roads commputer the last rego was in s.a ...when i spoke to mr furness,s son i think he told me it was the 75th van in the 3 year ....brenten
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Post by Don Ricardo on Dec 27, 2016 14:38:14 GMT 10
Hi SGTL, I contacted the seller, but he told me that he couldn't find any serial number on the drawbar. He kindly invited me to come and have a look at the van to see if I could find a number, but unfortunately he is in Adelaide, and I am not.  Don Ricardo |
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Post by Don Ricardo on Dec 27, 2016 15:36:52 GMT 10
Hi again Brenten, So that explains the tag.  I'm interested in the explanation that 3075 equals 'the 75th van in the 3rd year'. If that is correct then the Ebuy van with serial number 441 would be the 41st van built in year 4, Furness's van number 318 would be the 18th van built in year 3, and the van from the FNQ tip would be the 43rd van built in year 2. That does raise a couple of other questions, though. The first is why does your van have a '0' before 75, when none of the other van serial numbers do? I can well imagine that in year 3, Furness may have worked out that they were going to produce more than 99 vans in that year and so added the '0' before the '75' to allow for 100+. But if that is the case, you would think they would have allowed for 100+ vans in year 4, by numbering the Ebuy van 4041 instead of 441? The second, bigger question is, if the first digit indicates a year as in year 1, year 2, etc, when was year 1? I don't think it can have been the first actual year that Furness started production, because that year was sometime before the war, and at least as early as 1937 because we have a photo of a Furness from a 1937 newspaper. So, for the sake of discussion, supposing year 1 for Furness was 1937, then that would make year 3 1939, and your van would have been built in 1939 - but that doesn't fit either because your van is a post-war van with the sliding doors and windows, not pre-war with the hinged doors and windows. So perhaps, Furness started numbering their vans after the war, but that still leaves the question of when was year 1? We know that Furness ceased production during the war (see article just posted on the DHL Furness thread), but when did they re-commence production again? Was it 1945, 1946 or 1947 and did whatever year that was equate to year 1? One issue with that is that there are some post-war Furnesses which don't appear to have serial numbers welded on to their drawbar. The van seen by Marktaylor here is an example, and the van referred to by SGTL above appears to be another. So perhaps the serial numbering system was introduced sometime after production of some of the post-war vans? But when? Sorry Brenten - I'm asking more questions than providing answers - as usual  - but the Furness numbering system, how it worked and when it started, still seems to be a bit puzzling. I wonder if the Furness family is able to tell us any more? Don Ricardo |
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Post by selkane on Jan 13, 2017 10:01:27 GMT 10
Hi SGTL, I contacted the seller, but he told me that he couldn't find any serial number on the drawbar. He kindly invited me to come and have a look at the van to see if I could find a number, but unfortunately he is in Adelaide, and I am not. Don Ricardo Hi Don and All, I am the new owner of this van and going to pick it up on Saturday, all being well with the description over the phone of course. Once I have it we will be restoring it over the next 12 months so I am happy to look around for any serial numbers etc. Thanks Selkane |
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Post by penny61 on Jan 17, 2017 19:17:46 GMT 10
This van is still for sale. I went to look at it today... my interstate sister was interested in buying it to rent out on her property. Unfortunately its a bit more of a project than she thought... but she was practically begging me to go look for her.
The serial number seems to be underneath the more modern 50mm ball hitch... as opposed to the polyblock type thing that would have been on it originally. Which is a shame as the seller bought it off the son of the (now deceased) original purchaser... who bought it in 1941. Would have been a definitive date.. .
Most of the original interior is gone. The original owner and his son lined the inside with wood look panel and clad the outside in aly in the late 60s... even the roof although the canite is still underneath.. and wired (had it wired?) it for electricity. Masonite can still be seen in the backs of what's left of the cupboards.
Hopefully it finds a new home soon.
Penny61
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Post by Don Ricardo on Jan 25, 2017 15:33:40 GMT 10
This van is still for sale. I went to look at it today... my interstate sister was interested in buying it to rent out on her property. Unfortunately its a bit more of a project than she thought... but she was practically begging me to go look for her. The serial number seems to be underneath the more modern 50mm ball hitch... as opposed to the polyblock type thing that would have been on it originally. Which is a shame as the seller bought it off the son of the (now deceased) original purchaser... who bought it in 1941. Would have been a definitive date.. . Most of the original interior is gone. The original owner and his son lined the inside with wood look panel and clad the outside in aly in the late 60s... even the roof although the canite is still underneath.. and wired (had it wired?) it for electricity. Masonite can still be seen in the backs of what's left of the cupboards. Hopefully it finds a new home soon. Penny61 Here are a couple of photos of the 1941 Furness currently on offer on Gumtree...   ...PLUS some additional photos posted on behalf of Penny61 following her recent inspection (see above):         Thanks for sharing the pics, Penny61. Don Ricardo |
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Post by willies on Jan 27, 2017 19:06:01 GMT 10
It's back on Gumtree for $250!!!!!!
. If I had the room I would but the driveway is already at capacity plus 1 car on the street.
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Post by Roybeth on Jan 29, 2017 19:49:22 GMT 10
k - been on our day road trip and picked up hubby's furness -  luckily he is good with wood .... inside is looking good, though it has had a 70s upgrade we think, previous owners striped out the blue 70s flower wallpaper and most of the rat droppings (ewww)  unfortunately the original hitch has gone and someone has welded a trailer hitch over the top of the serial number, though we are all guessing it is 863?  :-) |
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